Please Donate to cover costs and finance law suits by NY Carpenters
UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT
SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK
-------------------------------------------x
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA,
Plaintiff,
Index No.
-against- 90 CIV 5722
(CSH)
DISTRICT COUNCIL OF NEW YORK CITY
AND VICINITY OF THE UNITED
BROTHERHOOD OF CARPENTERS AND
JOINERS OF AMERICA, et.al.,
Defendants.
-------------------------------------------x
Independent Investigator Deposition
April 19, 2004
4:00 o'clock p.m.
CONTINUED DEPOSITION OF MICHAEL NEE,
taken by the Independent Investigator, Walter
Mack, Esq., pursuant to letter subpoena, at the
offices of Doar, Rieck & Mack, Esqs., 217
Broadway, 7th Floor, New York, New York 0007-2912,
before Harold Rabinowitz, a Shorthand Reporter and
Notary Public of the State of New York.
NATIONAL REPORTING INC.
A ReporterLink Systems Company
Computerized Transcription/Litigation Support Services
TEL: (877) 733-6373 <> FAX: (845) 398-8948
1 73
2 A P P E A R A N C E S:
3
4 DOAR RIECK & MACK
217 Broadway, 7th Floor `
5 New York, New York 10007-2911
6 BY: WALTER MACK, ESQ.
Independent Investigator
7
8 O'DWYER & BERNSTEIN, ESQS.
Attorneys for Union
9 52 Duane Street
New York, New York 10007
10
BY: JASON FUIMAN, ESQ.
11
12 KOEHLER & ISAACS, ESQS.
Attorneys for the Witness
13 120 Broadway - 29th Floor
New York, New York 10271
14
BY: STEVEN ISAACS, ESQ.
15
16 HOWARD SCARVALONE, ESQ.
Assistant United States Attorney
17 United States Department of Justice
86 Chambers Street
18 New York, New York 10007
19
ALSO PRESENT:
20
DONALD SOBOCIENSKI
21
22
* * *
23
24
25
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2 M I C H A E L N E E , the witness herein,
3 having been previously sworn, resumed and
4 testified further as follows:
5 EXAMINATION (Continuing)
6 BY MR MACK:
7 Q Good afternoon, Mr. Nee. Thank
8 you for returning to help me continue my
9 quest here to be able to figure out all I
10 haven't figured out yet.
11 As you'll recall, the most
12 important thing here is to take your time and
13 honor your oath. I would remind you that
14 you're still under oath from last time. This
15 is simply a continuation of our last meeting;
16 and really, the most important thing is to be
17 truthful and accurate and honor your oath.
18 As I had said last time, I'm not
19 a prosecutor. I have no authority myself.
20 In many respects what is happening here is an
21 effort to understand the system as it works
22 concerning you and a specific jobsite on
23 which you were the shop steward, and what the
24 impact was of the way it worked or not.
25 As I told you last time, I'm an
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2 agent of the Court, and as such, I intend to
3 write a report about this. So, in terms of
4 predictions as to what the outcome would be,
5 I can't do that.
6 The main thing for me is to
7 understand a number of things, and you are
8 here today to assist me in doing that. As
9 far as I'm concerned, there's not a right or
10 a wrong. The most important thing is what
11 happened. What is the explanation for the
12 particular entries that are in the records
13 that I have, recognizing that you're the most
14 important person to be able to tell me that
15 the record is accurate, the record is
16 inaccurate, or I have the answer or I don't
17 have the answer.
18 One of the questions that came up
19 last time was about a welding skill, and
20 that's what we're going to start with today
21 when we get going in a few moments. But
22 basically, as far as I'm concerned, what I'm
23 looking for is you telling me what the facts
24 are.
25 Is that clear?
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2 Do you have any questions with
3 regard to what is going on here today?
4 A No, sir. This is very clear to
5 me.
6 Q Good.
7 Let me mention one thing that I
8 did not say last time, because I wasn't
9 directly aware of it: Your attorney, Mr.
10 Isaacs, in whom I have great confidence with
11 respect to his skills and competence, but
12 some portion of his fees or maybe all of them
13 will be paid by the District Council, and
14 it's important -- I'm not sure whether that's
15 true or not, but at least I have been told by
16 the Director of Operations that that may be
17 true. I have no problem with your having an
18 attorney. In fact, it makes it easier for me
19 because, I know you're well-represented, and
20 if you have questions there's someone you can
21 talk to; but the most important thing is that
22 Mr. Isaacs is bound, under his code of ethics
23 as an attorney, to ensure that when he
24 advises you, his interests are yours. Even
25 if the District Council may be reimbursing
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2 fees or paying fees for you, his obligation
3 is to you, and your obligation is to tell the
4 truth. So, it's at least possible that
5 something you may say could be critical of
6 the District Council, and his obligation is
7 not to be worrying about the District
8 Council, but to worry about you and make sure
9 that you know what is happening.
10 I wanted to be sure that you were
11 aware of that; and as far as you're
12 concerned, that it doesn't bother you because
13 his fees may be paid by the District Council;
14 because his job is to ensure that you're
15 rights are protected, even if your testimony
16 maybe somewhat critical of the District
17 Council in one form or another, and you're
18 aware of that possible conflict and you have
19 no problem with proceeding, recognizing the
20 District Council may be paying some of his
21 fees.
22 A Not whatsoever.
23 Q Good.
24 Also in the same line, he may be
25 representing other individuals who have
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2 served either as shop stewards for 608 and
3 may have interests that are distinct from
4 yours; in other words, they may conflict with
5 you, possibly. I have know reason to believe
6 that they would, but that is also a potential
7 conflict of interest.
8 I have great confidence in Mr.
9 Isaacs' ability to discern or understand, if
10 a conflict should arise, because his job
11 today is to worry only about Michael Nee and
12 no one else. And if he has other clients
13 whose interests may be the same as yours,
14 they may be different, it's his obligation to
15 ensure that he's not conflicted, and you
16 should understand that he may have other
17 clients who potentially may have information
18 that's adverse to you. But you have no
19 problem in proceeding, given the fact that he
20 may have other shop steward clients different
21 from you; is that right?
22 A That's fine with me.
23 Q And again I have great confidence
24 in Mr. Isaacs' ability to discern when you
25 might have a conflict, and if he does, it's
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2 his obligation to tell you about it so that
3 if you want other counsel to consider it and
4 think about whether or not, gee whiz, what is
5 the best thing for Michael Nee to be doing
6 here, it's his obligation to raise that and
7 make that decision. Do you understand that?
8 A I understand it perfectly.
9 Q Do you remember, do you
10 understand that you're still under oath, and
11 that we are simply continuing from last time?
12 A Yes, I do.
13 MR. MACK: Mr. Isaacs, is there
14 anything that you wish to add or say
15 beyond what you have said on the record?
16 MR. ISAACS: No. Nothing to add.
17 MR. MACK: Good.
18 Jason, I know Mr. Nee knows that
19 you're an attorney for the District
20 Council. In an excess of caution, I
21 want to make sure that there is nothing
22 that you want to say.
23 MR. FUIMAN: Nothing.
24 MR. MACK: Mr. Assistant
25 Scarvalone?
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2 MR. SCARVALONE: Nothing.
3 MR. MACK: Then let's proceed.
4 Q Where we'll start off is where we
5 ended last time. I wanted to bring your
6 attention back to March of 2000, and ask you
7 with the benefit -- and you have a number of
8 records. Let's just go over those so that we
9 can be certain, and if you need any of the
10 records to assist you, you'll have them
11 available.
12 Let me make a brief discussion of
13 what the records are.
14 I'm relying on MN-3 and 3A, which
15 are records of your Benefits Fund
16 contributions. These are records provided to
17 me by the District Council. I don't know if
18 they are accurate or not. If I have to, I
19 can subpoena the companies who reported
20 these. And if you believe these are
21 inaccurate, I'll do that to be sure I have
22 accurate data, but I'm relying on 3 and 3A as
23 a guide for your benefits contributions.
24 (Documents, Benefits Fund
25 contributions, marked Exhibits MN-3 and
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2 3A for identification.)
3 Q I'm relying on MN-1, which is the
4 employment history computer printout which
5 was provided me and of which you have a copy.
6 And you should refer to any of
7 these. This is basically what I'm using to
8 try and stay current.
9 I'm also going to rely from time
10 to time on MN-5, which are copies of the
11 various requests relating to specific jobs,
12 and MN-7, which are further examples of
13 requests for you or manning request forms. I
14 wants to make sure you have copies of those,
15 so that you can refer to them from time to
16 time.
17 (Referral documents marked
18 Exhibit MN-5 for identification.)
19 MR. ISAACS: I don't believe we
20 have 5.
21 MR. MACK: 5 is actually somewhat
22 redundant, but let me give you a copy.
23 (Handed.)
24 MR. ISAACS: Thank you.
25 Q So, what I would like to start
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2 off with, and you can refer to any of these
3 and I'll try to refer you to them directly,
4 but as far as I'm concerned, these are the
5 records that concern you. But, as I say,
6 your recollection is more important to me
7 than these records. I'm trying to understand
8 them.
9 If you would go to March 30, 2000
10 on your employment history, and I may
11 actually ask -- well, you'll see that -- and
12 again, remember that there's a three-hour
13 time difference because the mainframe
14 computer, as I'm told, is on the West Coast.
15 I have you adding on March 30,
16 2000 -- March 30, 2000 is a Thursday -- at
17 9:19 and 9:20 in the morning, the skills of
18 concrete and welder. Last time you told me,
19 I think, and you can think about that answer,
20 is that welding was not a skill that you had
21 been certified in one way or the other, but
22 my question really is: Why did you add those
23 two skills on that day, if you remember?
24 A On the welding, I'm doing
25 welding. I understand, Mr. Mack, that you're
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2 going back only to '99. I'm in the union
3 since 1978, and I'm doing spot-welding from
4 '78 to '99.
5 Why don't you go back to '78 and
6 find out what I done?
7 You're a lawyer and I'm a
8 carpenter. I can do what I'm doing good.
9 Q I'm sure that's true.
10 A From '78 to '99 I didn't see no
11 certifications.
12 Now you're looking for
13 certifications for all this --
14 Q No, I'm not. This is my real
15 question.
16 A Let me ask the question.
17 Q Okay.
18 A I don't see why I should have to
19 hold back welding, since I'm doing it for
20 twenty years, approximately. Before.
21 Q Okay. So, if I'm to summarize --
22 and I don't think there was a certification
23 required at this time, in any event.
24 A There was no certification for
25 nothing before probably '98, '97.
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2 Q Okay. I'm not challenging your
3 skill as a carpenter, nor am I challenging
4 your skills as a shop steward. I don't want
5 you to think that my questions are
6 challenging you as a carpenter.
7 I'm trying to understand why
8 things happened at a particular time and in a
9 particular way. Okay>?
10 A I understand that.
11 Q Now, the reason that I am asking
12 you about this, given what you've just told
13 me, you could have put welding skills down at
14 any time.
15 A Anytime; and I'll do it again
16 tomorrow.
17 Q All right.
18 A Because I was doing it for 25
19 years now. I don't see what the big deal is.
20 I did it today. I did it on the
21 job today. I don't have certification for
22 that. I don't need it. They don't call for
23 it.
24 Q That's a matter for the union to
25 decide, but here is my question: You put it
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2 down, the record tells me, on a particular
3 day at a particular time. And on that very
4 day you received a Century Maxim job that had
5 those skills added. So, my question is:
6 Were you aware, basically, from anyone, that
7 by adding those skills, you would be eligible
8 or more likely to be picked up for this job
9 at Century Maxim?
10 A Yes.
11 Q Please just explain that to me.
12 A I was aware that the more skills
13 I had, the better. The best way to go to a
14 job and to do your job. I know about 500
15 members. I know right now -- we topped out
16 today. I know about three jobs that will
17 start next week.
18 At that time I knew that job was
19 going to start.
20 Q Did you know that job was going
21 to start as a result of talking to someone?
22 A I know that through the members.
23 Q Explain that to me. I'm just a
24 lawyer, not a carpenter. You'll have to
25 explain that to me.
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2 A There are over 8,000 members in
3 608. I talk --
4 Q What I'm trying to understand, is
5 that with this particular job, or did you
6 have a discussion or did you know from
7 someone that if you put down concrete and
8 welding on that day, that you would be more
9 likely to get that job at Century Maxim?
10 A First of all, it was a concrete
11 job. Like I tried to explain the last time,
12 it's a concrete job. 99.9 is what I do, and
13 I put down concrete.
14 Q Right, but you also put down
15 welding.
16 A I did it like I told you, because
17 I figured that -- if the occasion arises,
18 I'll do it. I don't have to be certified for
19 it. I wasn't certified for twenty years.
20 Nobody asked no questions for twenty years.
21 So, I put it down.
22 Q I'm not challenging you. You
23 have to be patient with me. I'm just a
24 lawyer.
25 A I'm listening.
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2 Q I'm trying to understand why it
3 was on this particular day you put down
4 welding when you hadn't for twenty years
5 before?
6 A Because I knew there was going to
7 be spot-welding done on the job.
8 Q That's my question: How did you
9 know spot-welding would be done on this
10 particular job for Century Maxim?
11 A Because I knew there would be
12 some Q-decks and I know about the job that
13 was coming up, from the members.
14 Q I'm going to take a look here,
15 and let me ask you a couple of questions
16 about, particularly, this job.
17 Now, did you know an individual
18 by the name -- and it could be Robert or Bob
19 Richardson, from Century Maxim?
20 A Bob Richardson is the super at
21 Century Maxim.
22 Q I want to you turn -- so you'll
23 know why I'm asking these questions -- within
24 MN-7, and maybe your counsel has found the
25 page I'm looking at, which is this dispatch.
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2 And I see there -- you know, this is a
3 concrete job, but I see that the two skills
4 that you added that morning, concrete and
5 welding are specifically requested for this
6 job.
7 And my question to you is: Had
8 you had any contact with Mr. Richardson about
9 the importance of having those skills for
10 this job before he put the request in, a
11 manning request, for this position?
12 MR. ISAACS: We are referring to,
13 just so we are clear, it looks like in
14 the top right-hand corner there are some
15 numbers?
16 MR. MACK: Yes.
17 MR. ISAACS: So, the skills
18 needed, among other things, were
19 spot-welding and concrete. There's
20 OSHA, there's protection.
21 Q As of March 29, you did not have
22 the skills down of concrete and welding. The
23 next morning those two skills are added by
24 you, and that very afternoon Mr. Richardson
25 requests a job with those two skills.
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2 So, I'm trying to learn from you
3 why it was that you put those skills down
4 that day.
5 A It could be for any reason. As I
6 told you before, I have those skills. I
7 don't have to be certified. Concrete is
8 concrete. I do welding. I don't have the
9 certification for it. I knew it was going to
10 be a long job.
11 Q It was a job worth getting, in
12 other words?
13 A Without doubt, in my mind.
14 Q I guess the question, just to
15 follow up on it, is, had you had any
16 discussion with someone from Century Maxim
17 about the need for welding skills on this
18 job?
19 A Not with Century Maxim.
20 Q And what you're telling me is
21 that you did have conversations with people
22 from 608 about welding skills?
23 A There are a lot of friends of
24 mine that I was working with, and whatever.
25 Q And can you remember any
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2 particular individual who let you know that
3 welding would be an important skill for this
4 job?
5 A Well, I'll put it this way to
6 you, Mr. Mack: We'll have lunch and we'll
7 have coffee. We all start talking. We know
8 when a job is going to start and we know when
9 a job is going to finish. With 40, 50 guys
10 there, it could be anyone.
11 Q But it is your recollection that
12 at least one of those individuals told you
13 that welding would be a skill needed for that
14 job; is that true?
15 A Correct.
16 Q Now, let me ask this question:
17 Were any of those individuals who discussed
18 this job beforehand union officials, such as
19 a business agent or someone else?
20 A Not with me. I'm sure they knew
21 about it, but not with me.
22 Q Now, just so that I don't forget,
23 you know that basically -- and I think you
24 answered this last time, but I want to make
25 sure that if you want to provide me more
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2 data, as I read your benefit records, it
3 lease appears to me that during that time
4 period you were already working for Century
5 Maxim.
6 A That was February 14. We
7 discussed that last time, if my memory is
8 right.
9 Q You're remembering correctly.
10 A I think I told you the job was
11 going to finish. There was a stoppage and I
12 put my name on the list at that time, and I
13 left it on.
14 Q And I guess the stoppage question
15 I have for you: Do you remember anything
16 about the stoppage or -- if I go back, I have
17 you put putting your name on, on February 16,
18 2000. That is when I have it.
19 A I was close. I said February 14.
20 Q No: Listen: I appreciate your
21 precision. But I guess my question is, that
22 I do have you being paid by Century Maxim
23 after that date and right through the date
24 that you accepted this referral as a shop
25 steward.
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2 A With no doubt in my mind.
3 Q Now, in going back down the list,
4 I see you with regard to your history --
5 A You don't have the whole history.
6 You only have part of it.
7 Q All I have is what the records
8 are.
9 A You only have six years. You can
10 go back to '78.
11 Q As I have said, I have no
12 criticism. I'm sure you're a very good shop
13 steward and carpenter.
14 A You should see without work for
15 three or four months, you can't pay the bills
16 that way.
17 Q It's my job to try and understand
18 the system.
19 A But when you say the history,
20 you're only looking at a portion of the
21 history.
22 Q If I went back to '78 and '79 and
23 if I asked you questions about that, your
24 lawyer would say, why are you asking
25 questions from way beyond?
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2 A Well, five, six years ago is way
3 beyond. Some things I remember from twenty
4 years ago, but some things I don't remember
5 from yesterday. If I had that memory, we
6 wouldn't need the computers.
7 Q I have to use the computers.
8 A I have one, but I don't use it.
9 It was better work done without it.
10 Q That may be true. That may be
11 true.
12 In any event, I have you going
13 back on the list on May 21, 2001. I would
14 ask you if you could tell me -- at least the
15 records as I see them have you working in
16 that time period at Century Maxim. Your
17 benefit records reflect that you're at work
18 during that time; is that correct?
19 A Yes, I did work.
20 Q My question to you is, what is
21 the basis of your going back on the list on
22 May 21, 2001?
23 A Very simple. I knew the job was
24 coming to an end by that June. So, I put my
25 name on the list because I want to keep
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2 working.
3 Q Okay. Now, were you aware -- at
4 least my understanding is, that your not
5 supposed to be on the list when you're
6 working.
7 A Technically not, but I did it.
8 Q Did you ask anybody?
9 Would anybody say gee, Mike Nee,
10 its okay, put it on, or we want you to go on
11 for a reason?
12 Was this entirely your decision
13 or did someone advise you to do it?
14 A There are a lot of guys on the
15 list. Guys will put their names on the list.
16 You might stop off for a coffee, for a beer,
17 and it was the thing to do; and I done it.
18 Q Would you say that that was a
19 routine practice by other individuals -- I
20 don't want to pick on 608, but even when they
21 were working, to put their names on the list?
22 A Well, if you know that the job is
23 coming to an end in a month or a couple of
24 weeks, you put your name on the list, yes, at
25 that time, yes.
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2 Q So, let me make sure I
3 understand. This job that you're talking
4 about that you were dispatched to as the shop
5 steward in March of 2000, that job was at 315
6 West 33rd Street?
7 A Well, it was between 34th and
8 33rd.
9 Q But that's the job we are talking
10 about.
11 When you say the job was coming
12 to an end, is that the job that you're
13 telling me that was coming to an end?
14 A Yes.
15 Q What was the information,
16 basically, that you knew about this job? You
17 know, when did you think it was going to end;
18 June?
19 A When you're on the roof and you
20 can't go no further and there is no pickup
21 work to do, you better start looking.
22 Q Now, you yourself put your name
23 on the out-of-work list before the job ended.
24 We just agreed to that.
25 A Me and the owner.
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2 Q Now, were you looking for another
3 job, or hoping for another job, when you
4 added your name to the list?
5 A I was definitely hoping.
6 Q I know you were.
7 Did you have in mind a particular
8 job that you were interested in or hoped to
9 get?
10 A Nothing. Some job. A week's
11 wages someplace.
12 Q Take a look at your history
13 there. I don't have to ask you these
14 questions.
15 What happened? What did you do?
16 You went to a couple of jobs. I
17 see in June and July "unable to reach." You
18 were working at the time.
19 Then you accepted a job in July,
20 but you were only there for a day. It was an
21 Urban Foundation job. I just want to get an
22 idea of what happened on that job. And let
23 me refer you specifically to what I'm talking
24 about so that you can take your time and
25 think about it.
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2 A I remember it very well.
3 Q Why don't you tell me about what
4 you remember.
5 A I was wasn't going to stay there
6 because it wasn't too much of a job. Me and
7 the foreman didn't get along, and you have to
8 look ahead.
9 Q These are the things you have to
10 tell me.
11 A Very simple. If it was a year's
12 job or a six-month job, not a month's job.
13 And I'm going to put my name on the list and
14 be there for three months? I don't think so.
15 Q Let me see if I understand, and
16 you tell me if I have this wrong:
17 You went to this job at Urban
18 Foundation, 96th and West End?
19 A Yes, I did.
20 Q When you got there, what was your
21 assessment of the job? What did you think of
22 the job?
23 A Just a regular concrete job, a
24 foundation job, no big deal. Just like the
25 rest of them.
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2 Q How long did you think that job
3 was going to last?
4 A I would say a couple of weeks.
5 There was some other shop steward -- the job
6 was half-finished when I got there. I wasn't
7 the first shop steward there, if you look at
8 the records.
9 Q What was wrong with the job?
10 A There was nothing wrong with the
11 job.
12 All I'm saying is that I am not
13 going to stay on the list for three weeks,
14 for four weeks for a four-week job. You have
15 11 days to stay on the list. Somebody has to
16 pay the bills.
17 Q I understand that.
18 I think you said that you didn't
19 get along with the foreman?
20 A There was a few of them during my
21 career. That was another one. It's no big
22 deal.
23 Q On this Urban Foundation job, was
24 there a problem that you couldn't remember?
25 A There was no problem. I saw that
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2 there wasn't much left there, and I was on
3 the list.
4 Q Well, you had been on the list,
5 and you went off the list to go on that job?
6 A Exactly.
7 Q You didn't like the job?
8 A I didn't stay I didn't like the
9 job. Me and the foreman didn't get along, I
10 said.
11 Q And also you felt the job
12 wouldn't last that long; is that fair?
13 A Without a doubt in my mind.
14 Q So, you left the job and went
15 back on the out-of-work list?
16 A Correct.
17 Q And I have you going and
18 accepting another job -- and again let's --
19 well, on July 19, 2001 and this job -- well
20 the company's name was Aurash at 120 Church
21 Street.
22 A I don't think I worked there, to
23 be quite honest with you.
24 Do you have any benefit hours or
25 working hours for that? I don't remember
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2 that one.
3 Q That's why I'm asking you about
4 it, because if you look at MN-7 --
5 A 120 Church Street?
6 Q I don't have any benefits paid --
7 let me just make sure.
8 A I don't think I was there.
9 Q Why don't you take a look at the
10 records?
11 A I wasn't on that job.
12 Q That's why I want to be careful
13 and you straighten me out, please.
14 I see you going back on the
15 out-of-work list on July 17, 2001; okay.
16 On July 19, 2001 I see -- at
17 least the records show that you accepted a
18 referral to this Aurash job. It looks like
19 the gentleman who called was John Greany.
20 A I wasn't there.
21 Q That's why you are here --
22 MR. ISAACS: MN-3A would seem to
23 indicate that there were no benefits
24 paid on July 21 or July 20.
25 Q That's why I'm asking you --
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2 A I don't recall that job.
3 Q Do you recall talking to John
4 Greany about a job that you refused to take?
5 A No.
6 Q So, as far as you can remember,
7 you never accepted a job for Aurash? The
8 address I have here is 120 Church Street.
9 A No doubt in my minds.
10 MR. ISAACS: Just a quick
11 question: Instead of me scribbling
12 notes and notes and notes, are these
13 transcripts available?
14 MR. MACK: No. Not until I
15 report to the judge; and then they'll be
16 fully available. That's just my
17 practice, to do that.
18 MR. ISAACS: Okay.
19 Q Now, I see you go back -- at
20 least the records reflect this. You go back
21 on the out-of-work list on July 20. You feel
22 free to look at that, because I'm just
23 reading this off here. Then I see that
24 there's a message here that calls are to be
25 held and that your name is to be frozen from
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2 July 20, 2001 until August 20, 2001.
3 Can you tell me what's happening
4 there?
5 A In plain English, if I'm on the
6 list and if I don't see nothing good coming
7 up, I can, by law, freeze my number until I
8 see something good coming up. Plus I was
9 doing my kitchen in the house. I was busy
10 enough.
11 Q I see there are some hours being
12 reported for you during this freeze period by
13 Century Maxim. So, I wonder if you could
14 explain that.
15 A I didn't hear that now.
16 Q Take a look, if you would, at
17 your benefits records.
18 A Just rephrase it.
19 Q Sure.
20 As I understand it, there are
21 some reported hours during the period of the
22 freeze.
23 A With Century Maxim?
24 Q With Century Maxim. I don't want
25 to mislead you. You can look at them, but it
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2 says 14 hours -- you know, during this period
3 that this freeze is in effect. You take a
4 look at this.
5 A It's very possible. I think I
6 worked with Century Maxim a couple of days
7 with Charlie, a friend of mine, up on 110th
8 Street. Yes, I can do that. As long as I
9 didn't go over the 11 days.
10 Q I'm not interpreter of the rules.
11 The rules will be interpreted by the District
12 Council.
13 A I understand.
14 Q If your understanding of the
15 rules was that you could freeze your number
16 and still work --
17 A You can freeze your number and
18 you have 11 days, and they kick you off the
19 list. If you get 11 days'work, they kick you
20 off the list. That's my understanding. I
21 could be wrong, but --
22 Q You know, the District Council
23 will be looking at this transcript, and it's
24 their job to make the rules. I didn't make
25 the rules. I just want to understand the
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2 them.
3 A Sure as hell I didn't make the
4 rules.
5 Q I know that's true.
6 A My recollection, Mr. Mack, is
7 that if I stayed inside the 11 days, I'm
8 still on the list. If you go over 11 days
9 working, you got to start on the back of the
10 list again.
11 Q This is something that you may
12 want to talk to the District Council about in
13 going forward, in terms of whether that's the
14 appropriate rule or not, because at least
15 it's my view that whenever you work you're
16 supposed to report it to the District
17 Council, but I may be wrong. It's the
18 District Council's job to enforce it.
19 A I can call the list when I'm
20 working and call the list when I'm off it, so
21 I can see how many days I got in.
22 Q Because the theory is, that if
23 you go to work or you shape a job, they take
24 you off the list for the days you worked. If
25 you only worked two days, you call them and
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2 you say, I worked two days, and they knock
3 down the time period and you're back on the
4 list.
5 A That's my understanding as far as
6 my recollection of it is concerned.
7 Q Let me give you what has been
8 marked as MN-9. It has somebody else's
9 records in there, too, but I want to at least
10 make them available here.
11 (Document marked Exhibit MN-9 for
12 identification.)
13 (Copies handed to Mr. Nee and all
14 counsel by Mr. Mack.)
15 Q I would like you to look at the
16 last page of that exhibit. I don't know if
17 that's your writing or not, Mr. Nee.
18 (Pause.)
19 Q My first question is, is this
20 your writing? Is this something you did
21 yourself?
22 A I don't recognize my handwriting.
23 Q It's dated July 20, 2001, which
24 is the time period we are talking about. It
25 may have been written by someone else --
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2 A It says "To whom it may concern.
3 Please keep my number on file until further
4 notice."
5 Q The computer entry is to freeze
6 the number until August 20, 2001. All I'm
7 asking you is to explain this --
8 A All I'm saying is that I could
9 have called somebody -- I could have called
10 my wife, I could have called my friends and
11 said, this is what you do: Freeze my number.
12 I don't go on the computer. So, I don't
13 know.
14 Q I'm not accusing you of being on
15 the computer. I'm just asking you if you
16 recognize this document.
17 A No, sir, to be honest with you,
18 no, sir. But certain people does it for me.
19 I don't go on the computer or the fax, or
20 whatever.
21 Q But this is a document that at
22 least looks like it supports your freeze;
23 that's all. I'm just asking you if you can
24 recognize it or if it's something you
25 authorized, and apparently you did because
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2 you were on a freeze.
3 A I would do it again tomorrow. If
4 I'm out -- like last time I was out three and
5 a half months, and I got three days or four
6 days' work, I'll freeze my number because I'm
7 not going to take it.
8 Who is going to pay my bills for
9 three and a half months, Mr. Mack; if you
10 will, I'll talk very nice.
11 Q I always hope you'll talk nice.
12 A Well, I'll talk a lot nicer if
13 you paid my bills.
14 I'm in business to pay my bills.
15 Q I understand that.
16 Let's continue, because I notice
17 that on August 14, if the computer is working
18 accurately, that what they say -- it's right
19 at the bottom there, it says "Erased hold
20 calls," which has the effect of unfreezing
21 your number; do you agree with me on that?
22 A Yes, sir.
23 Q I'm asking you if you remember
24 why it was that you erased your hold calls.
25 Did you know another job was
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2 coming up?
3 A When was that?
4 Q August 14, 2001 at 9:16 in the
5 morning.
6 A I think I knew there were a
7 couple of jobs starting.
8 Q Do you remember what you knew at
9 the time?
10 A I knew Century Maxim was
11 starting. I knew Sorbara was starting.
12 Q What was the job that you knew
13 was starting for Century Maxim?
14 A I think they had two jobs
15 starting.
16 Q Tell me what they were.
17 A I don't know what they were
18 exactly. They had one in Battery Park and
19 one somewhere else.
20 Q What do you remember about the
21 Sorbara job?
22 A They had a job starting uptown
23 someplace.
24 Q Now, how did you know that those
25 jobs were going to start?
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2 A As I told you, I know a lot of
3 members.
4 Q Okay, but I'm asking you
5 particularly if you remember on this occasion
6 how you came to know about these jobs.
7 A As I said, I don't recall who I
8 was talking to, which members I was talking
9 to, but I knew where the jobs were starting.
10 That's what I pay union dues for. If I'm not
11 working I'll I be in the City every day, and
12 I'll tell you any job from the Battery to
13 110th Street starting; no business agent;
14 nobody has to tell me. That's my duty. You
15 hustle, you keep working. You won't get no
16 jobs laying in bed.
17 Q Now, had you had any conversation
18 with John Greany about any of the Century
19 Maxim jobs?
20 A Not about Century Maxim jobs.
21 Q How about any other job here, and
22 I'm asking really about August of 2001. Did
23 he tell you there were jobs available?
24 A I know John Greany for twenty
25 years. He would probably tell me there are
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2 jobs starting, and I'll go out there and see
3 what is going on, myself.
4 Q Now, I can understand if you're
5 shaping and getting work one way or the
6 other. But what I'm talking about now is
7 being dispatched for shop steward jobs which
8 are a reflection of the way the out-of-work
9 list works.
10 A I understand.
11 Q So, what I'm asking you is, did
12 you know that in fact there was a job about
13 to start that you wanted to be the shop
14 steward on? No?
15 A I didn't want to be a shop
16 steward because that only goes by the list.
17 It's like playing the lotto.
18 Q So, why is it that you erased
19 your hold calls, in other words, went back on
20 the list on August 14, 2001, if you remember?
21 A If I know I'm low on the list,
22 I'm going to unfreeze. I had rather be in
23 with a shot than no shot.
24 Q Of the three jobs we've talked
25 about -- I don't know what the other Century
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2 Maxim job was, but what would be the job you
3 wanted the most?
4 A All I wanted to do was to keep
5 working. Like I said before, I'll keep
6 working. I have to pay my bills.
7 Q Now, was there any discussion
8 about any of the job skills that were
9 necessary for a particular job?
10 Did you have any knowledge, as
11 you knew about welding from the last time we
12 talked, was there any particular discussion
13 that you had with a member, that concerned
14 particular skills that you needed for any one
15 of these three jobs?
16 A As far as I'm concerned, I put
17 down the same concrete and layout for most
18 concrete jobs.
19 Was there more skills? I don't
20 think so. I could be wrong, but I don't
21 think so.
22 Q Now, in terms of your skills, was
23 there a need at the Battery Park job for
24 layout skills?
25 A Without a doubt, yes.
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2 Q Just explain that.
3 A Any concrete jobs, there's always
4 layout, yes.
5 Q So, in your view, layout was an
6 important skill for that job?
7 A I always put it on. You don't
8 have to be certified for it, but I put it
9 down.
10 Q I know you had that skill. My
11 question is, did you have any discussions
12 with anyone concerning having the
13 foreman/layout skill placed on that job?
14 A No.
15 I went through this: This is the
16 way it's done for three years before and it's
17 basically the same thing I put down.
18 Q But sometimes Century Maxim jobs,
19 concrete jobs, they don't put down
20 "concrete."
21 I'm trying to understand how you
22 knew that foreman/layout was requested.
23 Do you have any information as to
24 why it was in this case, and why it wasn't in
25 other cases?
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2 A As I said before, I was doing it
3 for twenty-something years; and all of a
4 sudden they are looking for it now? I put it
5 down and I'll put it down on the next job. I
6 can do it. I have been doing it. You don't
7 have to be certified for it. I think as far
8 as I'm concerned, the more skills you have,
9 the better, to stay on the job.
10 Q I agree with you. There is no
11 question about that. All I'm trying to
12 figure out is why a particular skill was put
13 down for a particular job in one case, and
14 not another.
15 A I can be on the train with thee
16 of my members today from work, and we would
17 be talking "where is the next job?"
18 At that time the certification
19 came in. "What did you put down? What did
20 you not put down. What did you get away with
21 not putting down?" Whatever.
22 Q Was there any information about
23 the Century Maxim or the Sorbara job as to
24 what skills would be good to put down?
25 A I had a fair idea. Like I told
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2 you, the one on 34th Street I knew there was
3 spot-welding there and I put it down.
4 Q What about the Battery Park job?
5 A I didn't know about that, really.
6 I probably put a few extra certifications in
7 there at that time. You know, I can't go
8 back that far, but I probably did.
9 Q I just wanted to review. I may
10 have asked this of you already, but the
11 reason you erased your "hold calls"
12 approximately six days earlier than you had
13 planned, was because you knew there were good
14 jobs coming up; is that right?
15 A I knew my number was low, number
16 one.
17 Q Do you know what your number was?
18 A I can call the Council every
19 morning. Is there any record of you calling
20 the Council for your number?
21 Q I think there is.
22 A I wish there was.
23 Q There may have been or there may
24 not have been, in 2001.
25 A You need to have the whole issue.
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2 When I'm out of work, I call my number in the
3 morning, every morning. If I know a good job
4 is coming up and my number is low, yes, I'll
5 unfreeze. You have to have the full story.
6 Q That's why I'm talking to you.
7 So, basically, what do you
8 remember about Century Maxim job at the
9 Battery Park project? Was it a good job, a
10 long job?
11 A About six, seven months.
12 Q Definitely a job, a good job to
13 take and be shop steward at?
14 A It's very average.
15 Q Why do you say it was average?
16 A There are some projects that go
17 on for ten years and some that go on for
18 three days.
19 Q But certainly a six-month job is
20 a good job to have --
21 A It's better to be on a six-month
22 job than a three-day job.
23 Q Now, can you explain to me why
24 you went back on the list in October, 2001?
25 A October, I think I went to
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2 Ireland. We got a headstone for my mother.
3 I went home for awhile.
4 Q Sorry to hear that.
5 Can you give me some idea of how
6 long you were gone?
7 A I left the first week in
8 September, I think. I was gone five or six
9 weeks. When I got back, I was out for a few
10 weeks.
11 Q Take a look and -- look at your
12 benefit funds.
13 A September or October.
14 MR. ISAACS: Are you going to
15 take that sort of 15-minute break we
16 usually take?
17 MR. MACK: Let's take it now.
18 Let's take an eight- to ten-minute
19 break.
20 (Whereupon a recess was taken. )
21 MR. MACK: Back on the record.
22 Q Obviously you're still under
23 oath, Mr. Nee. All of your rights and
24 everything -- I know you won't be bashful to
25 ask me to be clear about my questions or
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2 anything like that. I won't worry about
3 that.
4 A No, sir.
5 Q So, here is my question to you:
6 I have you going back on the out-of-work list
7 on October 22, 2001. That's what the record
8 reflects. So, I'm not really sure when you
9 went to Ireland to visit your mom --
10 A I made a mistake. I have it the
11 wrong year. 2001 I was dispatched to that
12 job the 25th of August, I think.
13 Q You went on August 14. You were
14 dispatched by John Greany to Battery Park in
15 August of 2001.
16 Let me show you what the records
17 reflect. We have a lot to cover today. I'm
18 going to try to go more quickly so you can
19 get out and get home. But I have you erasing
20 your hold calls on 9:16 a.m. on August 14,
21 2001. And on that very day at about 3:59
22 p.m. you accept a referral to Century Maxim
23 at Battery Park. That all happened on the
24 same day.
25 A We went through that; right?
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2 Q We went through it, but I'm not
3 sure that I understand it.
4 A Well, 9/11 came up, and that job
5 was shut down and I put my name on the list.
6 Q October 22 I have you --
7 A I don't know exactly -- believe
8 me, if you look at my medical history, it
9 wasn't too good, either.
10 Q Sorry.
11 A I was down there volunteering for
12 a week. I did a lot of volunteering down
13 there, but I don't want to go into that,
14 either.
15 Q My compliments.
16 A Yes, that time was a little
17 screwed up.
18 Q It was screwed up for everybody,
19 but I see benefits being reported for you at
20 Century Maxim all during October 2001, and
21 yet I have you going back on the out-of-work
22 list. And I'm asking you if you could
23 explain that to me.
24 A To be quite honest, I don't know,
25 Mr. Mack. We were shut down. It was on a
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2 Tuesday. I was right there that morning.
3 Q Me too.
4 A I had a bull's eye view of the
5 whole thing.
6 Q Me too.
7 A We were shut down for that week
8 and the following week, and I went on another
9 Century job the following week.
10 Q What job was that?
11 A 42nd Street.
12 Q My question, if you remember --
13 and that was a time of stress for everybody.
14 That's why I wanted to talk to you, but I
15 have you working for Century Maxim pretty
16 much full weeks there --
17 A I don't know if they are that
18 good that they pay me for the week. I know
19 we were off for that week and probably the
20 first couple of days of the next week.
21 Q If you and I understand each
22 other, if you remember, do you know why you
23 put your name on the out-of-work list on
24 October 22, 2001?
25 A I could tell you a lot of things,
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2 but that time there was a lot of crazy
3 things. I don't remember too much about
4 those couple of months.
5 Q The good answer if you don't
6 remember, is to say you don't remember.
7 A I don't remember.
8 Q But at least the records -- I
9 can't speak for Century Maxim, but it appears
10 to me that you were being paid during the
11 period that you went back on the out-of-work
12 list. I want you to explain that to me.
13 A It's very possible that I put my
14 name on the list that week, but if you look
15 at the hours, we didn't get the full week.
16 Q You look at the hours with me
17 here, and if I'm wrong here -- the first time
18 I see you get a full week, except for the
19 week ending October 9 where your one day
20 short --
21 A I'm going back to 9/11.
22 Q You look at it. You look at your
23 record. I'm certainly not going to presume
24 to tell you what your records reflects.
25 (Pause while witness confers with
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2 counsel.)
3 Q Look at your records.
4 A I see them.
5 Q If you can explain them to me,
6 you're invited.
7 If you don't remember, you don't
8 remember.
9 A As far as I see I missed a week's
10 work.
11 Q And the week of September 18,
12 you're only credited for 14 hours. That
13 would be the two days. Monday and Tuesday
14 you were there.
15 A To be quite honest with you, them
16 couple of months now, I don't remember a
17 whole lot about it. I can take medical
18 records in to support that, but right now we
19 won't go there.
20 Q I want you to -- you have a good
21 attorney here. I'm interested in your side
22 of all of these issues.
23 A You're saying to me that I put my
24 name on the list --
25 Q And you were working.
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2 A It's very possible.
3 Q If you can remember why you did
4 that, or what were the circumstances, this is
5 your opportunity to tell me. If you don't
6 remember, you don't remember.
7 A That's one thing I don't
8 remember.
9 Q Okay. So be it.
10 Now, I'm going to skip over a
11 number of things here, because I want to
12 cover a number of things which are important
13 to me, more important than some of these, but
14 you may want to, in the course of your own
15 review of these records, you'll see, for
16 instance, that -- I see you go back on the
17 list in May of 2002. I also see your
18 benefits being paid in late May.
19 A As far as I know, I finished up
20 with Carlton in the first week in May, if my
21 memory serves me right.
22 Q Were you aware of a Century Maxim
23 job at the time, or were you working at
24 Century Maxim at the time? You explain to
25 me, what you remember.
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2 A I don't think I worked with them
3 in May nor June.
4 Q If you look at your benefits
5 record, you'll see that you have Carlton
6 Construction, Century Maxim. So, I have you
7 at least working a number of hours at the
8 same time you're on the list. You just take
9 a moment to look at it.
10 A I don't have to look at it. I
11 shaped a job on 110th Street, and I got a few
12 days up there, a week, something like that.
13 Q I want you to be careful, because
14 I have you shaping in the year later on.
15 A Well, I shaped that job, too, I
16 think.
17 Q You tell me. It's your memory
18 that I am looking for. Look at your hours,
19 because my question is that whenever you're
20 on the list you can assume I'm looking at
21 your benefits, and I'm saying why is Mr. Nee
22 on the list if he is working?
23 A Well, I assume, Mr. Mack, that I
24 had 11 days. 11 days and you're still on the
25 list before you --
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2 Q Okay, but I think the District
3 Council -- and these are District Council
4 rules, I'm trying to understand the
5 situation, but its my understanding that if
6 you're working, you should not be on the
7 list. That's the way it was explained to me.
8 A The way I look at it -- I could
9 be wrong, too.
10 Q I understand that.
11 A You have ten days to work. If
12 you go ever on over 11 days, you're off the
13 list.
14 Q Even by that rule, you shouldn't
15 have been on the list, if you count your days
16 up. We are talking about May of 2002. You
17 look at your record.
18 A I had a lot of broken time in
19 May, June and July of that year. As far as
20 I'm concerned, I didn't work that much. I
21 was off and on.
22 Q Are you telling me that I should
23 check the payroll records here of all these
24 people, that they may have erred and paid
25 you --
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2 A Sure. There were a couple of
3 days here and there with a few companies.
4 Q Now, you and your lawyer can talk
5 about this and think about this, but it's my
6 understanding that if you're working, even
7 for two days or one day, that you're not
8 supposed to be on the out-of-work list.
9 A Well, you know what? I probably
10 left it on, to be honest with you.
11 Q Well, I appreciate your honesty.
12 Let me go on to another dispatch
13 that I have some questions about. And again,
14 when I say questions, I'm not talking about
15 right or wrong. It's just so I understand
16 what is going on here.
17 In June, on June 3, you bypassed
18 on a referral. Then on June 4 you accept a
19 referral. You weren't there very long, West
20 Point Construction.
21 A I wouldn't even work there. It
22 was too dangerous. I wouldn't go on the
23 site. I called back the hall on that. I
24 didn't get no money for that.
25 Q It's just a question of what
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2 happened.
3 A It was unsafe. I went to the
4 job. I wouldn't start it.
5 Q Could you explain to me why it
6 was unsafe?
7 A My recollection is that when it's
8 not safe, it's not safe. I seen lolly
9 columns up there, and scaffolds. There were
10 digging pretty deep. As far as I was
11 concerned, they were half scabs.
12 Q Now, you know who Maurice McGrath
13 is; correct?
14 A That's the guy I told them about,
15 as far as I am concerned -- -- I remember
16 that that's the guy I told them about.
17 Q Did you talk to Mr. McGrath about
18 this job before you were referred to it?
19 A No, I did not.
20 Q You went to the job, you saw it
21 was unsafe. Did you then talk to
22 Mr. McGrath?
23 A I called him and I said don't put
24 me in for that; I'm not going to work there.
25 You can go down and check it yourself.
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2 Q Do you know if anyone went down
3 to check it after you reported it?
4 A I have no idea.
5 Q Do you, of your own knowledge,
6 know if the job continued with a shop steward
7 from the District Council?
8 A Mr. Mack, I have no proof of
9 that.
10 Q Did you have a discussion with
11 Mr. Maurice McGrath about that you wanted a
12 good job or another job or were there any
13 jobs coming down that you would like?
14 A I don't think so. I probably
15 told McGrath: You can check that out. Call
16 OSHA, as far as I'm concerned. Those were
17 the last words I said to him.
18 Q Now, I want to bring your
19 attention to June 6, 2002. I notice on that
20 day you're back on the out-of-work list and
21 at 10:02 a.m. you add the skills of drywall
22 and framing.
23 A Correct.
24 Q Do you remember, as we sit here
25 today, what brought you to add those skills?
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2 Did you have something in mind?
3 Why did you choose that day to put those
4 skills on?
5 A It's very, very simple. I think
6 I was out for a little while now, broken
7 time, and you do anything you can. You give
8 it a shot.
9 Q Were you aware of any job that
10 was coming up that would require those
11 skills, that you might get?
12 A Not to my knowledge.
13 Q Did you have any discussion with
14 Mr. Maurice McGrath about any particular job
15 at that time, that would require those
16 skills?
17 A No, sir.
18 Q Now, I see hours for the week
19 ending June 4, with Century Maxim and May.
20 So, again my question is: You're going to
21 jobs as a shop steward. You went to this job
22 on Greenwich Street with West Point which was
23 unsafe, and you declined it and what have
24 you.
25 A Correct.
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2 Q But at least my records are
3 showing that during this time period you're
4 continuing to work for other companies.
5 A I told you there were a few days
6 here and there. If my memory serves me,
7 there was a couple of days here and there,
8 yes.
9 Q Now, on June 6, and you can take
10 a look, you weren't at this job very long,
11 but Maurice McGrath called in another job
12 for -- it looks like BDW Wall Corporation at
13 47th Street and Tenth Avenue.
14 A I think I remember that job.
15 Q Can you tell me what you remember
16 about that job?
17 A I remember there was nobody there
18 when I showed up, as far as I'm concerned.
19 Q But you were referred there and
20 you went there, and what? You couldn't find
21 the job? Nobody was at the job? What was
22 the story?
23 A In all honesty, I didn't see no
24 job. And that happens.
25 Q Okay. So, you're going back on
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2 the out-of-work list on June 7, as I read
3 this?
4 A Correct.
5 Q And that very day you took
6 drywall off as a skill. Do you remember why
7 you did that?
8 A It's very possible.
9 Q I know it's possible, but were
10 you clear that you did not want drywall on
11 your skills at that time?
12 A Well, if you're out of work for a
13 while and you're given the runaround about
14 jobs where there is no jobs, you have to do
15 it.
16 Q I can understand why you would
17 put the skill on, but on the very day you
18 went to that job you took it off. Were you
19 disgust with drywall jobs, or did you just
20 not want a drywall job?
21 A Probably getting tired of the
22 whole thing. It cost me money to come in
23 from Jersey.
24 Q I hear you.
25 You may have taken it off because
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2 you were disgusted. You're still on the
3 out-of-work list.
4 A If you're out of work, you're
5 supposed to be on.
6 Q That's one of the questions,
7 because I see that you're at least working
8 during that time period here, but maybe not
9 full-time. Now, you can look at them as
10 well, but I see 53 hours the week ending June
11 21.
12 A As I told you, there was a lot of
13 small jobs there. I don't have much
14 recollection on that. I know there were
15 three or four or two, but I know there was a
16 lot of broken time.
17 Q Now, I see you going back on the
18 out-of-work list on June 25, and then I see
19 on June 26 you're being resequenced. Do you
20 know what that was about?
21 I know what resequencing is, but
22 what was it that was happening?
23 A What does resequencing mean?
24 Q I think they put you back to
25 where you were before you were assigned out,
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2 so you don't lose your place on the list, and
3 I am wondering if that was a result --
4 A I probably complained. If they
5 called me for a job, they probably took the
6 days off for the jobs that I went to and
7 there were no jobs there.
8 Q Do you recall calling to
9 Mr. Danielson --
10 A Believe me, I'll call and
11 complain if I'm out of work and if I'm sent
12 to a job where there is no job.
13 Q Did you do that in June?
14 A I think something like that
15 happened.
16 MR. ISAACS: For whatever it's
17 worth, Mr. Mack, and I don't know what
18 the rules actually are, since I have
19 never seen the out-of-work list rules --
20 MR. MACK: They are on the
21 website, if you want to look at them,
22 Mr. Isaacs.
23 MR. ISAACS: I will.
24 There's something about the
25 11-day rile being mentioned on 6/26.
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2 MR. MACK: That is true, but
3 that's based upon the supposition that
4 there is no work being performed. So,
5 I'm really just looking for a
6 recollection of what is happening.
7 Q You did have some work during
8 that time period.
9 A I don't deny that.
10 Q Now, I see you going back on the
11 out-of-work list on November 15, 2002. I'm
12 skipping over some things hear, because I
13 would like to keep moving along, but if you
14 would just jump with me to that.
15 So, I think we are in the time
16 period now where you might have gone to
17 Ireland to see your mom, because your
18 benefits records break from September 2,
19 2002 -- I'm looking at MN No. 3 -- until
20 December. Does that help you remember --
21 A Something like that, yes.
22 Q So, is it your recollection that
23 probably in the months of October and
24 November -- and again I don't want to put
25 words in your mouth here, because your
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2 recollection of what dates you were gone is
3 more important to me than reading your
4 benefits records.
5 What was your situation there in
6 the months of September, October and November
7 of 2002?
8 A I went to Ireland and there was a
9 few things going on, personal -- it has no
10 reflection on this here --
11 Q I have no intention of prying
12 into your private life.
13 A I took some time off which I
14 should have done the year before, but I
15 didn't.
16 Q Now, I see you going back on the
17 out-of-work list on November 15, 2002. Then
18 I have you -- and you may look at your
19 benefit records -- I see you working for
20 Century Maxim starting with the week ending
21 December 3, 2002. So, at least theoretically
22 if you were working starting in early
23 December 2002, you should not be on the
24 out-of-work list. So my question to you is:
25 Did you start or go back to work in December
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2 of 2002 when you came back from Ireland?
3 A Yes, I had was the same job.
4 Q Battery Park?
5 A Yes.
6 Q I should tell that you when I
7 look at this, I see lots of hours. I see 85
8 hours and I would like you to explain: Were
9 you working double weeks?
10 Why were you getting reported for
11 85 hours --
12 A No. That's from October -- I
13 came back before December, October or
14 something like that.
15 Q Can you explain that to me?
16 There are reported hours there in
17 the first week -- I see your last week as
18 September 3, 2002. I'm looking at MN-3.
19 Then I don't see an entry for you again until
20 December 3, 2002. Then there's 85 hours, 89
21 hours, and then the week after that is 70
22 hours.
23 A My recollection is that I was out
24 for seven weeks.
25 Q When did you go back to Battery
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2 Park?
3 A I think November, to be honest
4 with you. There could have been --
5 Q I'm asking you if you went back
6 in early November, before Thanksgiving or
7 after Thanksgiving, if you remember, Mr. Nee?
8 A I think it was early to
9 mid-November, something like that.
10 Q So, I at least, from my
11 perspective -- my understanding is a better
12 way to put it -- is that you were working at
13 Battery Park for Century Maxim but you're on
14 the out-of-work list as of November 15, 2002;
15 do we agree on that?
16 A Yes.
17 Q Even though you're working -- and
18 let me find this so that you have it right in
19 mind -- it's part of MN-9, and it's actually
20 the third page in. Would you take a look at
21 that, if you would, Mr. Nee?
22 (Pause.)
23 Q The first question with respect
24 to a letter which is dated December 23, 2002,
25 which is the third page in on MN-9 -- is
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2 that your signature, Mr. Nee?
3 A It doesn't look like mine.
4 Q Okay. Well, you tell me if it is
5 your signature or if it's a document that
6 you're not familiar with. Is this a document
7 that you authorized to be sent in?
8 A This one I don't recall, to be
9 honest with you.
10 Q Now, the job referral history or
11 the employment history says that you asked
12 that calls be held from December 23, 2002
13 until January 23, 2003; and at least the
14 records reflect that basically -- or at least
15 I have been told that the basis for that was
16 this letter of December 23, 2002, which
17 basically froze it for one month.
18 Do you remember asking that your
19 place on the out-of-work list be frozen for a
20 month at the end of 2002?
21 A It's very possible.
22 Q You know, your employment
23 records, at least to my eye, appear to me
24 that you're working steadily for Century
25 Maxim during this time period.
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2 A Its very possible, yes, I was
3 working steady, I don't deny that.
4 Q My question is, why, if you were
5 working steady -- I think the first question
6 is, why were you on the out-of-work list, but
7 the second question is, why are you asking
8 for a hold if indeed you did ask that it be
9 frozen for a month; do you remember that?
10 A I'll give you an answer on that
11 because I know I missed some time earlier.
12 Nothing will reflect on this, but I know the
13 job at Battery Park was getting finished
14 around Christmastime.
15 Could I have put my name on the
16 list a little bit early? It's very possible.
17 Q My other question is, why did you
18 put a freeze in; why did you ask -- if you
19 did ask. Maybe you didn't.
20 A No. That,I don't recall. That,
21 I don't recall.