263
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2 SEALED EXCERPT
3 OFFICE OF THE GENERAL EXECUTIVE BOARD ATTORNEY
4 LABORERS' INTERNATIONAL UNION OF NORTH AMERICA
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -x
5
6 In the Matter of
7
8 TRUSTEESHIP PROCEEDINGS
9 LOCAL 734
10 NEWARK, NEW JERSEY
11
12 - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -x
13
14
15 November 23, 2004
10:00 o'clock a.m.
16
17 Hilton Gateway
Newark, New Jersey
18
19
20 B E F O R E:
21 PETER F. VAIRA,
22 Independent Hearing Officer.
23
24
25
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2 THE HEARING OFFICER: I am
3 going to ask Mr. Slevin to give me his
4 offer of proof as to what Mr. Limberg
5 would testify to. Go ahead.
6 MR. SLEVIN: Mr. Limberg had
7 spoken with a detective, I believe on
8 Squad C5 which my understanding is
9 devoted to the investigation of the
10 Genovese organized crime family.
11 This detective was on at least
12 five surveillances in the Year 2000 in
13 which he saw Mr. Augie Vergallito and
14 Mr. Peter Rizzo appear at the Soho
15 Hotel in Manhattan to have meetings
16 that lasted approximately one hour
17 with two individuals.
18 The first individual is a
19 gentleman by the name of Pepe LaScala
20 who is acting capo of the Genovese
21 family. The second was the acting
22 boss of the family at that time was
23 Dominick Cirillo, a/k/a Quiet Dom.
24 When they appeared at the
25 hotel they did a check on the
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2 automobile and it checked out as being
3 owned by Rose's Taxi or Rose's
4 Limousine which we will attempt to
5 demonstrate later was an entity that a
6 Fund employee by the name of Isaac
7 Barocus --
8 THE HEARING OFFICER: I am
9 coming to the conclusion the best way
10 to handle this is that I will take
11 this testimony in camera and at the
12 end you guys can argue whether I
13 should accept it or not. I will take
14 it in camera and it will be sealed and
15 if I don't accept it it will be gone.
16 If I put it in, then I will
17 make a decision to put it in. You can
18 tell me. I don't know what to do with
19 the crowd. Should we just bring
20 everybody up here and have him testify
21 or should we just bring the witness a
22 little bit closer.
23 MR. LEDER: I think you have
24 to clear the room.
25 THE HEARING OFFICER: Let's go
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2 back on the record.
3 I have cleared the hearing
4 room and I am going to put the
5 following testimony in camera and then
6 I will ask you to seal it and make no
7 further disclosure outside of this to
8 anyone except your clients and at the
9 end, not at this moment but at the end
10 of this hearing I will make a decision
11 whether or not it should be in. I
12 will even consider it, all right?
13 MR. SLEVIN: If I could just
14 put something on the record.
15 Mr. Elko, I think I said that we
16 wanted him just to talk about
17 Mr. Vergallito.
18 There are other things we
19 would want him to talk about that
20 don't have to do with Mr. Vergallito's
21 La Cosa Nostra background.
22 THE HEARING OFFICER: All
23 right.
24 MR. LEDER: I would comment,
25 too, I want to put on the record that
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2 I believe the tie-in to this is that
3 there is an attempt being made to say
4 that the Funds were controlled and
5 therefore that is why there was
6 reluctance on the part of the union to
7 follow the directions of the
8 supervisor.
9 Well, if the Funds were
10 controlled, then how could they
11 possibly take the action they took
12 which is set forth in Exhibit 72,
13 Mr. Calastro's letter to Mr. Pocino
14 where he outlines a whole laundry list
15 of the changes in the Fund.
16 THE HEARING OFFICER: What
17 recommendation did he follow and said
18 a number of them.
19 MR. LEDER: And a whole bunch
20 of people were terminated at the high
21 salaries that were complained about by
22 the audit report and those other
23 supposedly where I guess we are
24 getting the inference that the Funds
25 are being controlled as you people
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2 call it by connected people and as if
3 they are being controlled how did the
4 Fund terminate all these people.
5 THE HEARING OFFICER: I see
6 the argument. That is why I am
7 wrestling with this issue.
8 If this was a disciplinary
9 matter I wouldn't touch this unless
10 there was some direct connection.
11 This happens to be a trusteeship,
12 whether the Trustee should continue,
13 but let me hear what there is.
14 T H O M A S L I M B E R G, called as a
15 witness, having been first duly sworn by
16 Tina DeRosa, a Notary Public within and for
17 the State of New Jersey, was examined and
18 testified as follows:
19 DIRECT EXAMINATION
20 BY MR. SLEVIN:
21 Q Mr. Limberg, can you state your name
22 for the record?
23 A Thomas Limberg.
24 Q How are you presently employed?
25 A As an inspector for the Inspector
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2 General Office of LIUNA.
3 Q How long have you been employed in
4 that capacity?
5 A September of 2002.
6 Q Do you have a background in law
7 enforcement?
8 A Yes, I do.
9 Q Could you just briefly summarize the
10 history of your involvement in law enforcement?
11 A Yes. I originally was hired as a
12 New York City Transit police officer in 1981. In
13 1983 I became a New York City police officer
14 working uniform details, patrol.
15 In 1985 I was assigned to the New
16 York City Police Department Organized Crime
17 Investigation Division, specifically the
18 investigation analysis section.
19 THE HEARING OFFICER: You then
20 became a plainclothes man?
21 THE WITNESS: Yes. At that
22 point I came out of uniform, worked
23 background investigations and
24 background checks on organized members
25 and associates.
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2 A In early '86 I was assigned to the
3 Luchese desk for the investigation analysis
4 section. I was a Luchese coordinator.
5 In December of '86 I was assigned to
6 an FBI Squad C17 which is a squad with the FBI
7 Brooklyn-Queens office. The main purpose was to
8 investigate crimes committed by Luchese LCN
9 family.
10 The squad was made up by both FBI
11 agents and New York City detectives. I worked
12 there until my retirement in 2002.
13 THE HEARING OFFICER: You
14 worked there 14 years?
15 THE WITNESS: Yes.
16 Q In your time on that squad did you
17 have occasion to investigate other Cosa Nostra
18 families?
19 A Yes. We investigated any crimes
20 committed by the Luchese family and in that many,
21 many times, in many cases those crimes were
22 committed in concert with organized crime families
23 and, in fact, with all five New York families and
24 the Calcanti family based mainly in New Jersey.
25 As part of that task force I was
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2 also assigned as the organized crime coordinator
3 for the squad. The sole purpose being I was
4 responsible for the maintenance and upkeep of all
5 intelligence on the family and responsible for
6 disseminating intelligence to other squads within
7 the FBI.
8 Also I have testified as an expert
9 in organized crime in the Federal court in the
10 Eastern District of New York.
11 Q Did your investigations involve
12 labor racketeering?
13 A Among others, yes.
14 Q What forms of labor racketeering?
15 A Cases that have involved the Hobbs
16 Act. Extortion in many different industries, the
17 freight industy, construction industry, garment
18 industry.
19 Q Turning your attention to this case,
20 did you have occasion to learn of any information
21 concerning any employees of Local 734 affiliated
22 benefit fund?
23 A Yes, I have.
24 Q Who?
25 A Specifically Peter Rizzo.
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2 Q Did you have occasion to learn any
3 information about any individuals that were
4 formally associated with 734 or its affiliated
5 benefit funds?
6 A Yes. August Vergallito.
7 Q What information have you learned
8 about Mr. Vergallito?
9 A In approximately the Year 2000 that
10 there were a number of meetings that took place at
11 the Soho Hotel in Lower Manhattan I believe on
12 West Broadway in the bar area, at least five
13 meetings.
14 They would occur on Wednesday
15 afternoon at 2:00 p.m. and these meetings would
16 include Mr. Vergallito, Mr. Rizzo, a man named
17 Pepe LaScala and man named Dom Cirillo.
18 MR. LEDER: Did you observe
19 this?
20 THE HEARING OFFICER: I am
21 going to get to that. Remember, we in
22 our brief little offer of proof he had
23 mentioned something about speaking to
24 a detective or something. So give us
25 the source of your knowledge. Start
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2 with that.
3 MR. SLEVIN: If we could it
4 lay out first. It will not take long
5 to state the facts and then we will
6 get to the basis of his testimony.
7 MR. LEDER: I don't think it's
8 appropriate.
9 MR. SLEVIN: What I don't
10 think is appropriate is the attempt to
11 interrupt the testimony.
12 THE HEARING OFFICER: I assume
13 he did not see this person.
14 THE WITNESS: No.
15 MR. LEDER: I object. That is
16 hearsay.
17 MR. SLEVIN: That shows your
18 unfamiliarity with the process because
19 hearsay can come in this proceeding.
20 MR. LEDER: Hearsay except
21 when you are trying to prove a fact
22 and you can't rely upon it.
23 MR. SLEVIN: Before you object
24 you should understand the rules.
25 THE HEARING OFFICER: Time
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2 out. I assume he is going to say
3 somebody else told him in some
4 fashion. That hearsay, is it
5 credible, reliable, that is for me to
6 determine.
7 MR. SLEVIN: That is right.
8 THE HEARING OFFICER: I assume
9 that he is going to tell us this
10 occurred. You want to go in reverse
11 order. I am still the guy you have to
12 convince and I am not going to be
13 convinced by hearing something
14 shocking and find out it has no
15 source.
16 I am an old prosecutor. I
17 understand hearsay and what is
18 corroborating and what is not.
19 You may go in the order we are
20 going and we will figure out if it is
21 reliable.
22 BY MR. SLEVIN:
23 Q Who is Pepe LaScala?
24 A In 2000 at the time he was acting
25 capo of the Genovese crime family, specifically
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2 acting for Angelo Prisco who was a captain, who
3 was incarcerated at the time.
4 Q Who is Dominick Cirillo?
5 A In 2000 he was the acting boss of
6 Genovese crime family.
7 THE HEARING OFFICER: Do you
8 want to tell me where Pepe is, where
9 he is or who he is. You have to tell
10 me what basis you are relying on.
11 Q What basis are you relying on?
12 A At this time I was still a member of
13 C17 with the FBI squad and had access specifically
14 to know that Dom Cirillo, also known as Quiet Dom,
15 was the acting boss of the Genovese crime family
16 from my work on the joint task force.
17 And my knowledge of LaScala's
18 position at this time is basically the same basis
19 as I learned the information.
20 Q What is that basis?
21 A From a detective Andy Varga,
22 V-A-R-G-A, who conducted, was on some of those
23 surveillance and personally identified the
24 individuals.
25 THE HEARING OFFICER: I want
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2 to know who Pepe LaScala is.
3 THE WITNESS: He was according
4 to Detective Varga an acting capo in
5 the Genovese crime family.
6 THE HEARING OFFICER: Is there
7 any other source of information that
8 could tell me that?
9 THE WITNESS: I don't have it
10 at this time.
11 Q Explain to the Hearing Officer what
12 attempts may have been made to corroborate
13 Mr. Varga's statements to you.
14 A These meetings were surveilled by
15 Squad C5, is a task force out of 26 Federal Plaza,
16 New York.
17 THE HEARING OFFICER: Federal
18 task force.
19 THE WITNESS: They
20 specifically talked with the Genovese
21 crime family. My understanding is
22 they have surveilled these meetings on
23 about five occasions and a
24 surveillance report and some
25 surveillance photos exist. We have
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2 made requests for those.
3 Q Did Mr. Varga tell you or Detective
4 Varga tell you how long these meetings lasted
5 approximately?
6 A I think approximately one hour.
7 Q Did he have any information
8 regarding Mr. Vergallito's vehicle?
9 A Yes. He remembered that
10 Mr. Vergallito would normally arrive at these
11 meetings in a car that was registered to White
12 Rose Limo.
13 MR. LEDER: Could you repeat
14 that?
15 A White Rose Limousine, a company that
16 the registration was under.
17 Q If you could for the Hearing Officer
18 explain Mr. Varga's background. What you know of
19 him.
20 A I have known Detective Varga for
21 about ten years. I guess I first met him when he
22 was assigned to the Genovese squad and worked with
23 the Genovese family.
24 He was also tasked with gathering
25 and documenting just basic intelligence on the
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2 Genovese family when he was assigned to the
3 Genovese squad.
4 Q What is the name of that squad?
5 A C5.
6 In the last year he has left the FBI
7 Federal task force. He is now assigned to the
8 investigation analysis section of the Organized
9 Crime Investigation Division for the New York City
10 Police Department. The sole purpose he is the
11 head analyst for organized crime matters.
12 Q Did Detective Varga eyewitness the
13 meetings that you just described?
14 A I am not sure how many. I know he
15 was personally there. He observed some of the
16 meetings. I am not sure he was there every time
17 the meetings were covered.
18 Q How does he know this was
19 Mr. Vergallito?
20 A Specifically I don't -- I can't say.
21 I know that there was no hesitation that he would
22 be Mr. Vergallito. Immediately my guess is
23 through informative information or other
24 surveillances concerning Mr. Vergallito. I can't
25 say for sure.
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2 Q Based on your background is there
3 any significance to the fact that when an
4 individual would meet with an individual like
5 Dominick Cirillo?
6 A Absolutely. Organized crime, La
7 Cosa Nostra, especially the New York families go
8 to great lengths to insulate the administration of
9 the family.
10 My history of working organized
11 crime cases or cases involving Genovese crime
12 family they are one of very, very strict with
13 security involving the administration. As an
14 example, specifically going back years ago when
15 Mr. Vincent Gigante whose nickname was the Chin
16 was the boss of Genovese family, no one was ever
17 allowed to say Vincent or the Chin, to say his
18 name. He would only be referred to by pointing to
19 his chin.
20 They went to great lengths to keep
21 the administration arm's length from everybody
22 excepting for the higher-ups of the family. So
23 that it was only on very rare occasions, generally
24 very important reasons for the boss of the family
25 to meet with people who were not boss, the
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2 consigliere or trusted capos.
3 Q What is the significance to you of
4 this meeting that Mr. Varga's witnessed?
5 MR. LEDER: Let me object.
6 They met with them and now we are
7 getting with why they met with him. I
8 am not sure no matter what this
9 witness says in response to that it is
10 probative of anything and I assume
11 what he is going to say is that there
12 was some business dealings being
13 discussed.
14 He is not even telling us that
15 he was there to see the surveillance,
16 plus he is not telling us that Varga
17 told him what they are talking about.
18 What was the significance of the
19 meeting, what were they talking about.
20 THE HEARING OFFICER: I don't
21 think so. I am well aware in the
22 world of organized crime there is no
23 such thing as social events with
24 outsiders. The proof is did he meet
25 with him and was he with him for a
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2 length of time. That is sufficient.
3 I don't need to know from him what he
4 thinks they talked about.
5 MR. SLEVIN: And counsel is
6 anticipating testimony that wasn't
7 going to come and is using the context
8 of a supposedly evidentiary argument
9 to make closing argument.
10 What we are trying to elicit
11 the significance of meeting with the
12 boss of the Genovese family, not what
13 was discussed.
14 THE HEARING OFFICER: I want
15 to know who was there. I still don't
16 know.
17 August Vergallito; right?
18 THE WITNESS: Yes.
19 THE HEARING OFFICER: Peter
20 Rizzo?
21 THE WITNESS: Yes.
22 THE HEARING OFFICER: Who
23 else?
24 THE WITNESS: An acting capo
25 by the name of Pepe LaScala.
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2 THE HEARING OFFICER: Who
3 else?
4 THE WITNESS: Dominick
5 Cirillo, also known as Quiet Dom.
6 THE HEARING OFFICER: Those
7 are the four individuals. Based upon
8 your information and be specific if
9 you know this, how many times did they
10 meet?
11 THE WITNESS: I believe that
12 the meetings were surveilled at least
13 on five occasions. Detective Varga
14 cannot recall specifically how many
15 more times or how long they were going
16 on before I guess they realized --
17 THE HEARING OFFICER: Just how
18 many, approximately.
19 THE WITNESS: I think they
20 were covered five times.
21 THE HEARING OFFICER: Once a
22 week?
23 THE WITNESS: The meetings
24 always occurred on Wednesday afternoon
25 at 2:00 p.m.
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2 THE HEARING OFFICER: What
3 period of time are you talking about?
4 THE WITNESS: Circa the Year
5 2000. I don't have specifics.
6 THE HEARING OFFICER: Where is
7 Detective Varga now?
8 THE WITNESS: He is assigned
9 to Police Headquarters, Organized
10 Crime Division.
11 THE HEARING OFFICER: This
12 information, you were still in the
13 government or the Police Department
14 when this information came to you?
15 THE WITNESS: No.
16 THE HEARING OFFICER: You were
17 outside the government working for the
18 Inspector General?
19 THE WITNESS: Yes.
20 BY MR. SLEVIN:
21 Q When did you have your conversation
22 with Detective Varga?
23 A About a week and a half ago, I
24 believe.
25 Q And he had spoke to you knowing you
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2 are no longer in the law enforcement?
3 A Yes. Knowing my current position,
4 yes.
5 MR. SLEVIN: As Mr. Limberg
6 said, there are efforts being made to
7 track down information related to the
8 surveillances.
9 THE HEARING OFFICER: Who made
10 these?
11 MR. SLEVIN: Information such
12 as photographs and any kind of reports
13 that have been made.
14 THE HEARING OFFICER: All
15 right. That is sufficient.
16 MR. SLEVIN: That is the
17 extent of it.
18 THE HEARING OFFICER: You may
19 ask him some questions.
20 MR. LEDER: Thank you.
21 CROSS-EXAMINATION
22 BY MR. LEDER:
23 Q Where were you when you spoke to
24 Detective Varga?
25 A I was on the telephone.
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2 Q The telephone, okay.
3 How did you start, how did you get
4 to the point of August Vergallito?
5 A Specifically I asked whether
6 Mr. Rizzo -- I asked about Peter Rizzo.
7 Q What did he say in response?
8 A He says he knows Peter Rizzo very
9 well and surveilled him a number of times with
10 Mr. Vergallito and he discussed what I testified
11 to. He told me about the meetings.
12 Q Immediately it came to his
13 recollection what happened in 2002?
14 A 2000.
15 Q Four years ago. Had he indicated
16 how he knew Peter Rizzo or August Vergallito?
17 A From my time back with the task
18 force I know he had a wide ranging case in the
19 Genovese family's involvement in the construction
20 industry.
21 Q Was Peter Rizzo ever employed in the
22 construction industry?
23 A I don't know.
24 Q Was August Vergallito ever employed
25 in the construction industry?
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1 Limberg
2 A Specifically I am not sure.
3 Q With regard to the five meetings in
4 2000, the Hearing Officer asked you if you knew
5 the spacing in between those meetings.
6 A I do not.
7 MR. LEDER: I have nothing
8 further.
9 THE HEARING OFFICER: When you
10 spoke to the detective, did he know
11 that you were really going to utilize
12 this information in a hearing?
13 THE WITNESS: Yes, he did.
14 THE HEARING OFFICER: Did you
15 tell him he were going to testify to
16 what he told you?
17 THE WITNESS: Yes, I did.
18 THE HEARING OFFICER: That is
19 fine. Thank you.
20 Take that out and put it in a
21 separate booklet.
22 (End of sealed portion.)
23
24
25
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